Last year’s was here.
We had some great ones last year, particularly from Amber, Belle, Ren and PlainsFeminist.
I will also do my part at being even more controversial than last year.
Here goes:
1) I agree with about 90% of this.
2) We took my daughter to “Rapunzel” last weekend. An unconventionally attractive woman who announced herself as Dakota came out to entertain the kids during intermission. Dakota asked what they wanted to be when they grew up. My daughter raised her hand and said “a recruiter like my mom.” Dakota had my daughter come on stage and pretend to be a recruiter (which involved pretending to type on a keyboard and talk on the phone – not very good dramatic value but she did what she could with the material). Dakota then called to me “thanks, mom, for being a good role model. We had a housewife last week.” Wow! That’s not something one says, especially in that crowd! Later, I and my husband had one of those “did you think she was cute?” conversations (which we have about guys too) and he said “yes, but it wasn’t until she said THAT, that I thought she was really hot.” My controversial admission: I love that he said that.
3) Although I disagree strongly with Ayn Rand on gender, race and homosexuality, I am very sympathetic to her views on economics and philosophy.
4) I’m a hypocrite. I can’t stand when guys express preferences as to minimum bust size. But if guys had their number of inches stamped on their foreheads, would I use that info in making decisions? Yup.
5) I’m not ageist but when people say “you don’t look 40!” I am very happy and think that’s a good thing. So maybe I am ageist.
* renamed because of legitimate critique of the “un-PC” language
Tuesday, July 8, 2008
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46 comments:
Heh, I'm going to do this too. Great meme.
Comment on your admissions - I would have been happy with Mr C in scenario #2. If there was a way to make #4 mandatory (well, maybe not the forehead because it would ruin my view of their faces - perhaps a discrete little stamp on the hand?)I'd be all for it. And RE # 5, I have to admit that I was a happy camper as a result of your "you look like you're 26 or 27" comments during dinner, even though I know you were padding somewhat to make me feel better.
Yep, I'm a hopeless case! Too bad I'm perfectly happy this way.
Hm, I don't think I ever shut up about my controversial opinions.
I LOVE the Dakota story, and very sweet both that your daughter actually knows what you do and that she wants to emulate you.
Octo,
actually, the way you phrased #4 doesn't make you a hypocrite... ;)
Would be interesting to see the effects of such an advertisement. I mean, there were no pants for most of evolution. It would probably be possible to answer the question to which extent size does matter ;).
Oh god... I have plenty to say... just give me time. Shit is hitting the fan right now family-wise, but yes, I WILL be back to this thread eventually.
Okay, here's one admission to start things off: I hate when people append "-wise" to the end of a word. Like I just did.
RE Amber's point - I will admit that I hate the American tendency to turn nouns into verbs. Parent is not a verb, people.
I squeeze the toothpaste from the middle
The older I get, the more vain I get
I really do want bigger implants
I'm a complete Law & Order Junkie
-I don't actually like beer, and while I like the occasional drink tbh could probably go the rest of my life without having another. otoh I drink way too much Coke.
-I am one of the assholes pushing and shoving and snarling on the subway, even though I can't stand any of the other ones.
-I've never actually been able to read Noam Chomsky. Or Foucault, or um a whole shitload of other people. Rand, too. otoh I just bought and am reading $40 worth of Buffy and Angel comics.
-I am one of those fanfic'y slash people, and a Bad Lesbian.
-I can actually name all ten of the Doctors in Doctor Who -and- many of their companions
-I swear a blue streak at my computer and other malfunctioning objects, often including words like "cunt," and quite possibly loud enough to disturb the neighbors, which still doesn't stop me from hating them when -they're- loud and obnoxious.
-I can't fold for shit.
-I floss the wrong way.
-I have library books sitting on my shelf from my last uni that are roughly ten years overdue.
I also squeeze the toothpaste tube from the middle. When people who squeeze from the bottom up (er) use my toothpaste and make it look like one of their tubes, I take great pleasure in squeezing it from the middle and destroying their work. They think they're so perfect.
belle - you floss?
I fear teeth.
and:
I don't like getting clean. I'm not always motivated enough to shower in the morning.
I really really dig being a mom. more than I dig being a partner.
I fantasize about my own funeral and the funerals of loved ones.
wolfie occasionally wears pink diapers because I don't care enough to hunt down the blue ones.
other true confessions inspired by belle:
my overdue fines exceed $300. and the library can bite my shiny metal ass.
Jon Pertwee is the Only Doctor for Me. (and this is embarrassing because he really was a rather minor Doctor in the canon, notable only because he came right before the Fourth Doctor.)
Tobias – good point, in the interests of scientific research, we should probably require this. All those poor CEOs with red corvettes! They’d know how women feel, with only a wonderbra and sweater between having ones size front and center.
Ren –I find age is not making me less physically superficial either. Oh well. L&O is a pretty high quality guilty pleasure, though, kudos to you. I'll cop to Bachelorette.
Belle – I hate beer too! And even more embarrassing *mumbles* I’m not quite sure what a slash person is.
AP – hear you on the showering, I work at home and even though I work out a lot, I don’t shower much. Also I wash my hair only once a week! The pink diapers – that’s a feminist brownie point!
it's just, getting out I get all cold and clammy and damp. yuck.
I don't mind swimming, though.
it's something about the soap-water interface, I guess.
Octo,
"Tobias – good point, in the interests of scientific research, we should probably require this. All those poor CEOs with red corvettes!"
I wouldn't mind as long as a big number wouldn't be considered public indecency ;) Just kidding ;) I think this is quite an interesting question for which there doesn't seem to be a satisfactory scientific answer - has the human penis evolved to its current size and shape as a sperm delivery tool or a display element in male competition or has it been sexually selected by women because it feels good inside their body? There's a good summary of theories in Geoffrey Miller's "The Mating Mind". Miller thinks that a female preference for tactile stimulation has given humans the kind of rhythmic copulatory sex we seem to enjoy most. And that that's why we have blood based erections as opposed to muscular erections and why we lost the penis bone since the lack thereof allows greater positional flexibility for tactile stimulation. That said, assuming female sexual selection due to "vaginal sensoric bias" and copulatory taste the fact that men are hiding it in human "culture" seems to indicate that it's not been an overly important fitness indicator for mating decisions, possibly opposed to the display of affluence (red corvettes).
"They’d know how women feel, with only a wonderbra and sweater between having ones size front and center."
Well, I suppose the veiling effect would have to be considered similar. And if a woman picks a red corvette driver because she thinks he's got a large penis, and he picks her solely based on her visible breast size, they clearly deserve each other. Maybe that's why there seems to be a (non-linear inverse) relation between male intelligence and a preference for particularly large breasts (can't provide a link for that though right now.) Oh, and btw, women DO hide the much larger, internal part of their clitoral tissue by nature, which is interesting, as its size seems to be partly related to women's enjoyment of sexuality (which, I would imagine, is quite an important fitness indicator).
About women who don't like showering - I promise you a big public 2009 discussion about that... here's a preview:
http://www.granta.com/Online-Only/Interview-Charlotte-Roche
Here's another quick one:
I don't think capitalism is evil.
Tobias: “ assuming female sexual selection due to "vaginal sensoric bias" and copulatory taste the fact that men are hiding it in human "culture" seems to indicate that it's not been an overly important fitness indicator for mating decisions, possibly opposed to the display of affluence (red corvettes).”
Only on a relative level, not in any fixed way, IMO. It’s like Maslow’s hierarchy. Women have on average been more economically dependent, and have therefore been forced to prioritize security in mating decisions. Were that to become less of a concern, issues like male endowment might operate a different way. For an underemployed woman, an inch less in penis size might look like a fair trade for $100K extra in household income. If she were to have a better employment situation, she might not make that choice. There’s a reason Paris Hilton is with male models and “The Girls Next Door” with Hugh Hefner.
Octo,
yeah, sure, on a relative level. Nothing's ever fixed in an evoltionary relevant timespan. The thing is though - assuming as you do that affluence (resources) became more important than sexual preference for penis types as mating criteria with increasing economic dependence of women following the invention of agriculture, this still begs the question why culture developed that allowed men to hide their fitness indicators. I mean, even as a secondary indicator those with more sought-after penises would have had no reason to hide it. And that, in a way, would require that affluent/influental males had an interest in pants because they were afraid of "naked competition". Possible, but I have doubts about that theory...
I think penis types are sexually selected by women, but they're not as much of a fitness indicator as other things - not necessarily a red corvette though ;) - which may be the reason for a higher variety of taste and thus a higher variety in genes.
"There’s a reason Paris Hilton is with male models and “The Girls Next Door” with Hugh Hefner."
I know what you're trying to say, as we've been there before. But as for the specific example, I think male bunnies are with Paris Hilton for the exact same reason female bunnies are with Hugh Hefner - trying to give their model careers a boost...
You're gonna love this (I think), but it's 23 minutes long - Helen Fisher talking at the TED conference about the science of love, lust, mating and how women moving back into the economic sphere is just what biology had in mind...
http://tedblog.typepad.com/tedblog/2006/09/helen_fisher_on.html
#1. I find these evolutionary psychology discussions super boring.
2. I love television.
3. I hate exercising.
4. Oddly enough, I love watching other people exercise in the form of professional sports, especially NFL football.
(PS Ayn Rand? Oh dear. Is this gearing up to let us know you're voting for McFuckface?)
SMMO, did you see the things I didn't like about her views? That's why I'm not voting McC. But if the only differences between BO and JMcC were economics, I sure would vote McC.
SMMO, did you see the things I didn't like about her views? That's why I'm not voting McC. But if the only differences between BO and JMcC were economics, I sure would vote McC.
Mostly I was teasing, but it brings up an interesting question. I don't think one can really divorce the social views of a Rand or a McCain from their economic views. It isn't a coincidence that the vast majority of those who have more, for lack of a better term, libertarian views on economics tend to also rank human beings in basically this order:
1. Has penis, is white, likes girls
2. Has penis, likes girls
3. Has penis
Ironically the most rabid anti-Marxists believe should own the means of production for babies.
Should read "ironically the most rabid anti-Marxists believe THE STATE should own the means of production for babies."
I'm not sure; I think it's just that the parties break out that way. For example, I know people like this: fiscally conservative (although pro-limits on CEO golden parachutes and anti-tax breaks for companies who send US jobs offshore), pro choice, anti-racism, pro gay marriage, environmentally cutting edge, pro investment in head start programs targeting class, race and gender, pro drug treatment vs prison for non-violent drug offenders. That person doesn't show up as a candidate in our 2-party system because the current system would never allow him or her to emerge as a candidate.
And for the record, I was OK with HRC's compromise on taxes. I'd have preferred her keeping the Bush tax cuts, but she wasn't going to do the social security all-the-way-up thing that BO's planning, which basically allows big biz to pass along costs to employees and consumers, but fucks small entrepreneurs, especially those funding their own health care and retirement. Nice.
But people like this are out there. I know a number who fit this description (including me). Some of them don't have penises, white skin or opposite-sex preferences.
smmo- I LOVE NFL football!!!
More:
* I am really starting to hate the word "privilege." Not the concept, not the legitimate analysis; but the way it's so often tossed around as an insult and a shield. The way even saying this makes me sound like the right-wing assholes I loathe. Big ol' FAIL stamp to all that.
* Whenever someones says something about a "soul-sucking corporate job" as if this is a generally-understood, universally-loathed thing, I bristle.
* I think people who talk about not doing what you love and the money will come, or it's more important to do something for love, passion, commitment, dreams, ideals, etc. than money, have never really known what's it's like not to have a safety net (or never had a circumstance come up where they had to realize they don't have one).
* When people ask - no, expect - me to do "pro bono" web development work, it REALLY offends me. It makes me feel like they don't appreciate my work or value my time. It comes off as them saying their time is more valuable than mine.
* I love Starbucks. Same as last year's confession!
Oops, that should say: "... people who talk about doing what you love and the money will come..."
1. I'll admit it: Motion in the ocean is important, and I don't need an aircraft carrier, but I do enjoy more waves with a vessel larger than a canoe. Or maybe it's just that after three kids, my vessel is larger than a canoe. Either way, all hands on deck is still necessary even with a bigger hull.
Too many ship metaphors?
2. I sing along to Redneck Yacht Club.
3. I think that Pain and Victimhood Olympics bug me even more than Mommy (aka Golden Vagina) Olympics. Somedays, I feel like such a uncompassionate bastard.
4. I like lipstick.
5. It really bugs the crud out of me when people freely admit to hating children.
I'm not sure; I think it's just that the parties break out that way. For example, I know people like this: fiscally conservative (although pro-limits on CEO golden parachutes and anti-tax breaks for companies who send US jobs offshore), pro choice, anti-racism, pro gay marriage, environmentally cutting edge, pro investment in head start programs targeting class, race and gender, pro drug treatment vs prison for non-violent drug offenders. That person doesn't show up as a candidate in our 2-party system because the current system would never allow him or her to emerge as a candidate.
But why have the parties broken out this way? The Republicans have gone very far the to right on social issues and have had the White House 20 of the last 28 years. Because many more people that are conservative socially are also conservative economically. There is a logical and organic relationship between the two.
Of course there are anomalies. I know them too. But there are very few people who are socially
conservative and economically liberal.
When such an enormous portion of our federal budget is spent on war I'm not sure how anyone can argue that Republicans will cut taxes. Yeah, sure, we might pay less now but someone is going to pay for past 7 years someday.
Amber – love those.
Re “privilege,” could not agree more. The overemphasis within the feminist movement just adds one more shame-oriented obstacle to the existing 8-ball. *It’s almost like we have infiltration from the good old P telling us things that are guaranteed to keep us second-tier. Except this time it’s us telling ourselves this! Eerie.
I agree re soul-sucking corporate job. I’ve had those, I’ve had pretty decent corp jobs, and also soul-sucking non-corp jobs.
And yeah, I definitely think it’s good to pursue passions, but those who can throw all their eggs into that basket usually have a LOT more sources of eggs where those came from. For those of us without such sources, not that we shouldn’t pursue dreams, but we need to distribute some eggs into safer ventures.
Fuck doing your day job pro bono. Also, query if male web developers get asked this question? Your time is worth money per hour. Now if they wanted you to develop web services for starving kids or something as a pro bono project, fine, but if it’s not like that, absolutely does not make sense.
SMMO -- yeah, I think they tend to go together enough to make that the breakdown. I'm just not sure about "vast majority." But that's semantics. I see your point. I think that there are enough of us in that Venn Diagram overlap, though, that assumptions can fall down.
Also, I don't expect Repubs to lower taxes either. At best, maintain Bush tax cuts and at worst, get rid of Bush tax cuts. Those are both things I can live with. My preference would be a democrat who's talking big about the social security thing and who will eventually flip flop on it. I think past weeks have shown this is a distinct possibility!
Fuck doing your day job pro bono. Also, query if male web developers get asked this question? Your time is worth money per hour. Now if they wanted you to develop web services for starving kids or something as a pro bono project, fine, but if it’s not like that, absolutely does not make sense.
Not sure if male web developers get asked more or less often than female ones; I think it depends more on the circles you move in. E.g., being around a lot of progressives and people involved w/ non-profits, it happens to *any* web developers - in my experience/observation, anyway. Sometimes it *is* for worthwhile causes like starving kids, but even then, I will only do it if I actually do have the spare time to commit. If not, it's not fair to me or to them to commit to something I cannot complete. I always feel guilty in those cases, but there are only so many hours in a day and I can't clone myself just yet!
Also, in a lot of cases, non-technical people vastly underestimate the amount of time it takes to develop the type of site they want. This is understandable, but I want *them* to be understanding when I explain to them the number of hours needed and the labor intensity involved and, accordingly, be realistic in their expectations.
But all too often, it's not something like starving kids - it's just so-and-so's pet project of the moment, and they think you'll do them a favor just because. These types of people usually don't ask with an air of actually asking; there's this tone of assumption, that of course I would do it, and if not, what's my problem? The worst was some guy from NORML (he was a friend of a friend, and we were at an unrelated event); I had literally just met him a few minutes prior, only said maybe two words to him and shook his hand - and he's handing me his business card and saying, "Hey, we could really use some pro bono web work..." WTF??
5. It really bugs the crud out of me when people freely admit to hating children.
I admit it, I've said that sentiment in moments of frustration or exasperation. I'm usually careful to clarify though that I don't hate children across the board - just certain behavaiors, and parents who don't seem to care, and I don't particularly want children myself at this point in my life (who knows, that may change later!)
Jozet -- love the ship analogy.
And I feel the same way re hating kids. Don't like them, don't have them. Don't like being around them, avoid places where that's likely. And then realize that this is how we all start out.
Also, in a lot of cases, non-technical people vastly underestimate the amount of time it takes to develop the type of site they want. This is understandable, but I want *them* to be understanding when I explain to them the number of hours needed and the labor intensity involved and, accordingly, be realistic in their expectations.
I got into a brief period of making wedding cakes for friends and family. I'm not a professional baker, but have had some training.
SO MUCH WORK. People have no idea. When one of my brothers asked for a second cake in 3 years I said no more.
I'm not sure it is a tech problem as a "people are assholes" problem. When my SIL to-be complained that a baker wanted to charge her $5 a head for a cake I said "I'd charge that much." End of discussion.
$5 a head? Absolutely! The cake for my daughters 4th bday this weekend is costing that. And it's totally worth it, a work of art. Still, I think we'll do 31 Flavors for the foreseeable future...I hate the idea of playing into the LA kids-birthday-vulgarity-competition thing.
SMMO,
Yeah, the complaining about price really bugs me, too. When I would quote people an hourly rate when I was doing freelance work (which nearly gave me an ulcer; I do NOT understand how people can do that full-time!) a lot of them would balk - and I was charging on the low end of the going rate! I'm sorry, if you're going to balk at $80 an hour, you're clearly not committed to having a quality web site.
People don't understand how much work goes into a lot of stuff that they, well, don't understand!
With web stuff in particular, I think it's hard too bc there isn't a physical *product*. I've felt like w/ people who make jewelry or that sort of thing, maybe it's easier bc people have to have some appreciation of the materials involved, labor, etc. Your cake example shows that that's not necessarily the case, though.
I also want to be clear, I never mind people honestly *asking* if I'd be able to do pro bono work for a certain project. If it's an honest question, and there's no assumption of what my answer should be and they're not going to get pissy if I say no, then it's fine. I'm a proponent of the "it never hurts to ask" school of thought. It's the people that clearly expect it that really chap my ass.
1) Even though I beleive in equality in terms of domestic work I make my husband take out the garbage daily. Somehow I cannot get passed this is mans work in my head...and besides its gross
2)As much as I hate Walmart I occasionally shop there...I am just to damn busy some days to run all over town.
3) As much as I know that it is rotting my brain and is completely offensive, yes I watch the Family Guy, and if you ask me about it I will deny it.
Renee, I must admit the ONLY reason I do garbage and various physical tasks is frivolous b/c they are more active and calorie-burning than the sedentary tasks MrO does like taxes and getting our will made (which we only just got around to now and was much too depressing for me to want to get involved with). The garbage cans need to go up and down a hill so I get points for doing it plus it's good for my glutes!
Other non-aerobic taskage like getting rid of dead animals (we've had mice and are near some woods so sometimes there are small dead animals in our yard)? That's all him.
Other
Amber -- sometimes the ones who fake sticker-shock need to hear: "you get what you pay for."
Worst example I've had of someone wanting a freebie? An "American Pie" actor came to the Vegas club once and asked to be comped a dance! I told him if he thought he was at Caesars and I was a slot machine, he was sadly mistaken.
I hope the Octolette has a great birthday!
It's was your birthday yesterday? Well, here's an entirely uncontroversial statment ;) - Happy birthday, and all my best wishes!
Thanks, SMMO!
Tobias -- not mine, my daughter's bday. She's 4. Thanks though!
Per the money and pro bono thing: where I can relate is how in the arts, there's this expectation that of -course- one will work for free or peanuts. Partly because there is, often, no money to be had, true; partly, though--and who knows which comes first in the chicken or egg scheme--this idea that y'know, well there are a few all wrapped up together in some weird scheme:
1) Art (theatre in my case, but it applies to others, no doubt) is a luxury, a frippery, and you're lucky to be getting any attention to it at all/a patron/etc.
2) Creating art is too refined to be soiled with vulgar motives like "eating" or "living well."
3) It's a competition, just like everything else only more so; you gotta claw your way to the top, baby! and because of 1) if not also 2), there are very very few spots available. Still, though,
4) follow your dreams! You never know! You, too, could win the lottery...!
Re children:
I just think it's like any other segment of society who/that gets stereotyped negatively as a whole due to the actions of a few. And with kids, most often it is the flippin' parents who are to blame, and yet so rarely is it spoken "I can't stand parents who allow their children to behave in ways _______." Even with that statement, it's tricky. Even within different cultures within the US, there are different expectations and parameters for acceptable behavior and acceptable parenting.
But yes, kids have to grow up somehow and learn how to become members of/within society, and unfortunately, they can't always do so when segregated to Chuck E. Cheese and the matinee. There are definitely the child centrics who think that having a child means that the world should revolve around them and their child's needs/whims/"learning moments", whether at Le Bec Fin or Applebees. And this sort of culture of " kid friendly" - sometimes a code word for "no parenting necessary" - which yes, keep the little barbarians tucked away until they can eat at the big people's table...I'm not sure that this always does any favors, either, and sort of feeds into the entitlement attitudes, I think, even while children are segregated, sometimes for their own good, sometimes for the good of others, but with fewer situations where kids are actually able to witness and be a part of and learn from mixed-age situations and activities which aren't geared toward them, which are still understanding to their limitations as well as their potential, and which find a valuable and meaningful role for children to fulfill.
Another thought by way of example: I like the idea of crying rooms in church. Some kids just aren't developmentally ready to sit still and quietly for an hour or more. But I'm not sure that ability to do so is a switch that gets flipped at age ___. As with most things, there is practice involved, and I think that, well, for the real child haters that I've met, there is just little to no patience or understanding for that, even when the parents are mindful of when a distraction is just too much and who draw their lines very close when it comes to "not acceptable".
With those people...I just don't see any difference with "I hate kids" than with someone saying "I hate mentally handicapped people" or "I hate old people". That's when I begin to react badly and think "for every screaming toddler, I can think of an adult who has been a pretty big jerk at times, and with less of a good reason."
Those are the "I hate kids" people I was talking about.
Belle -- that is so frustrating. There seems to be a general sense that if passion goes into something, it should be free. The logical endpoint of that is that everyone will be driven into passionless pursuits. I wish there were some midpoint between that expectation and the "follow your dreams, you might hit the lottery" verbiage.
Jozet --that makes sense, that hatred of kids could relate to hatred of other groups who for no fault of their own are different.
My daughter can be so frustrating, but unlike many adults, her actions are usually explainable -- lack of sleep, hunger, need for attention. Of course, with adults the actions are usually explainable too, but sometimes there is no remedy or one that's difficult to administer.
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